Future-proofing Your Career in Cybersecurity by Nicolas Moy

[Music] my name is Nicholas Moy I am a cyber security expert over 18 years of experience working in security engineering my specialty is in Cloud security software security uh do a lot of stuff with gc2 today I'm going to be talking about future proofing your career and cyber security but before we get started I need your help okay I want to take a selfie with all of you all right and we're going to post it online and I'll get to why here in a minute it's part of the conversation here all right so ready let's go ahead and and do this one two three all right thank you guys all right let's go ahead and get started

so it all starts with a calling right we find this interest we hear about this thing called cyber security we hear it makes a lot of money we hear that you get to work remote maybe do a little bit of traveling sounds fun right so maybe you're in the field already and you're wanting to level up maybe you're in this position where you're trying to break in right we had a lot of people on both sides that have said hey just help me grow in my career right so it starts with that calling that internal conversation and it starts on this path of trying to figure out where do we want to go how do we get there what

credentials do we need to obtain what trainings do we need need to do many of you are probably going to USF some kind of University right you're trying to improve yourself and you are answering that call by doing that right couple different experience levels regardless of your goal right you're trying to break in you could be a seasoned IT professional you know you're looking to level up or you could be that total Noob that's just trying to break in it's a lot right there's a lot to this there's a lot of opinions a lot of different uh Pathways you know you get a lot of YouTubers that are telling you to do certain things and you go get this

credential go get that credential right there's just a lot of noise and so what do we do how do we actually go about this and that's really what this presentation is going to be about is trying to help you answer that call and kind of find a road map a good clear path to achieving that calling that goal which is to break into cyber security or to level up in cyber security and to really future proof your career all right so you do what many of us do which is Google maybe go on YouTube I've done a lot of youtubing uh and then you're asking friends colleagues people you know maybe mentors or instructors how do I do this right

and you're going to get a lot of different opinions a lot of different uh responses okay I call this the echo chamber of cyber security advice and it typically follows as such right get your degrees get your certifications go find an entry level job at the help desk go build a home lab go get more certifications Kiss the Ring and serve your time or you just get lucky right so we're going to break a couple of those fallacies or just you know a lot of the the typical noise a lot of the typical responses you will hear when you're on the search okay the paths of old so back in the day this is when I was first getting started

I started when I was a kid because my dad owned his own consulting company so I got I got a lucky in that regard right but these were your typical paths one of these sis admin network engineer or admin software developer right times are changing though right where you don't necessarily have to be in one of these categories to start and then break into cyber sec companies are in desperate need for your help and there's good training out there there's lots of Pathways you can go about it that probably aren't as popular that will allow you to break into cyber security without necessarily having to break into one of these career paths first and what that does is shorten your

lead time to success all right kind of goes with this slide here so I'm getting ahead of myself times have changed okay the the demand is higher than ever we've got three 3.5 million unfilled cybercity positions by 2025 this was done on a recent study I oh right here cybercity ventures.com jobs so they have some data on this right this is only increasing if we look at the number of data breaches that are happening what does that tell us we need more people that fill that to fill these types of positions okay we have lots of great tools that are out there we need experts that understand these tools in order to start filling some of these

positions and this career is not going anywhere which is why you're here right all of you want to grow all of you want to break in 350 uh percent increase in cyber security job vacancy since 2013 like I said that's not going down and over 750,000 available jobs cyber security jobs just within the US hundreds of thousands okay I'm biased I like security engineering I think a lot of people don't think of that as an entry level position to get into but there are right there are ways that you can break into this without having to compete for a security analyst's role or compete for a GRC role or go through one of the paths of old okay so lots of

potential lots of potential the old ways Must Die okay and I'm telling you guys this because many of you come here with that belief system that I have to be a software developer I have to be at the help desk before I can break into cyber security and I can scale in my career that way you don't necessarily have to and there's lots of positions out there lots of companies with a support structure on the training that will happily take you in granted that you know just enough so that you're moldable and you have the right attitude and you can grow within that company okay so like I said traditional approach to pursuing a cyber security uh career

are old and outdated those were the paths of old right uh and then your non-efficient uh those are non-efficient approaches that do not necessarily serve you or your employer again employers are looking to scale they're looking to grow they need to fill these positions there's a lot of different benefits as to why that is so you taking this path is not only helping you but it's helping them and that's really what this is about like this is about giving right we need to make sure that we're serving and that we're jumping in the sooner so it's a beneficial thing for both sides okay so in this uh talk I'm going to introduce something called the estim

framework this is just my system my framework that I came up with something that I used over my career I now teach it to some of my students that help them get into the high demand in- demand jobs with least wasted time least wasted money things like that right because I I mean how many of you are studying for certification after certification and no one's paying attention to your resume your applications yeah that's why because we want to solve that right so it breaks out into three different phases get skilled get noticed and get paid all right first things first you guys have to change your mindset treat your career like your business because it is okay you are a

high value commodity when you get into cyber security and a lot of companies will pay a lot of money and as soon as you break in the hardest job is the first one you get from there you're just going to continue to scale up and you're going to be worth more and more money as you do so so treat it as business all right step one get skilled learn the skills that solve problems expensive problems people will pay big money when you solve expensive problems this is how well this is what I want you guys to really take away with or take away from this right if you are developing your skill sets in an area

that's high cost to the business you're going going to be worth a lot more to them especially if that area is in high demands one area there's a talk actually gentleman that just left he's giving a talk on cmmc cmmc is huge right now not a lot of people are going to be talking about it just yet but this is an area where a lot of contractors that do work for the federal government they need to get CM uh cmmc compliant this is an area where you guys can benefit by learning by getting ahead jumping into a niche skill set that the rest of the job market L rest rest of the labor market hasn't jumped into

security engineering same thing right Cloud security AI security start learning the trends of technology and focusing on how does security play a role in that that is what we're talking about when we talk about expensive problems okay companies hire it professionals to solve problems you guys are a subset of the business all right we got to get out of this notion of oh they're not giving me the budget or um you know I I'm I'm not no one's listening to me no one's paying attention that's not necessarily the case it's a business they got to make business decisions it's either we're going to secure our landscape or we're going to pay for marketing so we can

make more sales and uh bring in more profit more Revenue cyber secur is not a profit generating Department unless it is but typically it's not if you work for uh a mortgage company like I did once right you're not generating Revenue by implementing cyber SEC Solutions you're a cost to the business so you want to get in that in that habit of understanding you are there to support your business by solving those expensive problems and helping articulate why you need the budget in order to keep the business protected why do you need the budget in order to keep the business profitable or even to keep them a business because many times that's what it comes down to right cyber

security is a function of the business yes just covered that it solves and mitigates problems so you need to learn the expensive problems that companies are facing all right if possible if available try to obtain credentials around that skill set that's going to support it so I'm against the idea of going for the Security Plus most of the time right the reason why is because you're not necessarily gaining a skill set by doing that the Security Plus is a generalized entry level certification gives you a little bit of everything but not a lot of anything in particular if you know what I mean so try to develop uh try to obtain credentials that will support the

skill set that you're trying to develop the last gal here I don't know if you guys were many of you were probably here she was talking about trying to identify who do you want to become what's your end goal identify your intentionality uh with with this career right this this aligns with that because when you understand where am I headed what's that Final Destination going to look like you can start to develop your skills around that and and acquire the credentials to support that so over time all of your money all of your time are headed to the right direction they all support that end goal in mind and eventually you get that return on

investment it's like a swig of water

another key area is look up company pain points I was kind of alluding to this earlier right you want to understand where business is struggling when it comes to cyber security because what you're doing is you're positioning yourself in the flow of uh Investments you're positioning your flow uh or positioning yourself in the flow of where the money is going and that going to make it a lot easier to handle the friction of trying to get into this industry okay great way to do that look up Tech news go to Tech crunch uh filter out by you know the technology news let's go in there look at what kind of Investments are being sent out who are

they investing in you know um uh um investment VC Capital firms and all that look at where that money is going try to figure out okay if they're investing in this company what kind of Technology are they producing or what's this company doing that drew the attention of First Tech crunch that even wrote about it and and second the money the the investment that's coming through and then that's a good indication hey this is probably worth my time in the next I don't know three to five years for me to go ahead and get in there and then I can really scale my um value as a professional by doing that all right so we can look up

emerging Trends look at the news look at all that stuff right try to figure out where in technology is worth getting into here's a couple of great ideas these are some of the things that I focused on getting started I recommend this to other people because these industries aren't going anywhere Cloud security software security IC Systems industrial control okay Dev SEC Ops artificial intelligence cmmc that's uh Federal compliance right good areas to get into okay goes without saying develop your skills right and get the credentials that can kind of support it now a lot of uh certification providers or vendors they don't necessarily have the badges and credentials to help you along the way because they're behind in

the times education typically Falls a little bit behind where industry goes and and I can get into the details on that but you know it becomes a money maker for them when they eventually create a a credential that can support that but that doesn't necessarily mean you have to wait you can start to find um harder to find or smaller points of Education ISC 2 now obviously big they they they have the cissp and the sscp they also have skill Builder credentials which you can go and get if you're part of their membership program uh it's free so if you already have a credential it's free if um if if you don't if you're not

a member I think it's $20 a month or something like that for you to join and you can get access to their repository of of uh trainings and you can go through some of those trainings and start to acquire some credentials all right a couple of other ones that I like you know if we go back to the last slide on a couple of areas ideas where you guys can get started we talked Dev SEC Ops yeah there's Dev secop certifications sure but what about the tools that support Dev SEC Ops operations things like gitlab they have credentials too right or if we're going into uh I don't have oh cloud cloud security qualus has a bunch of free

credentials that you guys can go and start to obtain and what that's doing is that's helping you gain a um entry level or maybe even well-rounded understanding of what that practice is that that that function of cyber security would do but then also the tool which is even better because a lot of companies use that tool so it's kind of killing two birds with one stone there all right so next up getting noticed okay how do we get noticed I'm want to start this off by saying that attention is the new currency okay somebody mentioned it earlier today uh getting online and and sharing what you know and uh being vocal making a lot of

noise is going to help you drive more sales is what this person was kind of hinting at I think he was a sales rep right companies do that so they can bring in more profit you can do that as a practitioner too as a professional okay talk about what you're learning add value back in the industry educate other people by doing this you're going to come off as a growing professional which G increases your chances substantially of somebody taking a chance on you getting into this industry or leveling up okay couple of key ways you guys can go about this you can start to become an influencer start talking about emerging Trends or the latest data breach go on

Instagram make a a a I was thinking YouTube short you can do that too but Instagram real you can go on Twitter and talk about it right and just educate people give back hey this is what's going on if you didn't hear about it check this out right doesn't have to be super sophisticated but the key idea here is that you're getting in front of more people and recruiters and business owners and SE level Executives and all those people they're on those platforms too so when you start to hashtag and you start to talk about these things more and more you're going to to have a better chance a higher chance of increasing your visibility and

people are going to be like hey who's this person we we have a position for a sock analyst let's let's look into this person maybe they're a good candidate for this right versus you doing what everyone else is doing which is just submitting your application moving on to the next job role that you're going to apply to so give value um okay uh another thing I like to do is create articles on particular subject areas you link stands a great platform for this that's where all the professionals are right talk about it share forward hashtag become a social media influencer to a degree you don't have to be some guy that's doing funny dances but you should talk about these

things and kind of get more vocal and and share your uh knowledge and awareness of these topics and and broaden that to other people right they they're bound to find it and then grow your network this is both in person this is within your University this is within your workplace but this also applies online okay LinkedIn is a great place for this what I tell my students is hey every single day add 10 people to LinkedIn just say hey I want to add you to my network no-brainer then when you go and you share your posts on there they're the first ones to see it and the more active you get on these platforms social media platforms the

more these platforms are going to favor you and they're going to broaden your reach over time so it becomes compounding um okay we got a couple points here uh reach out to recruiters and hiring managers within your subject area so if you go on LinkedIn you can actually go and search hey recruiter for cyber security or recruiter for Dev psyops they put this in their profile and if you search for it in the search bar within LinkedIn you can find these people and just add 10 of them every single day Broad in your reach right and if that's the area that you want to go down that's the area I want to go down that helps because eventually somebody

paid attention to my stuff and extended a $200,000 Plus offer right so for those of you that are in the field you can get you guys can get that and for those of you that are trying to break into the fields you guys can also get that as well by sharing that value right talking about what you're learning but it all comes down to your network and your connections volunteer at charities within your subject area if you can a lot of Charities out there especially here in Tampa lots of nonprofits and they don't always have the budget to hire a big consulting firm like deits or ernston young or any of these others right so if you can come in there and

you can say hey I am learning this I am capable of doing X Y and Z Would you guys take a chance on me non-paid opportunity but it's experience many people are like how do I get experience of no one will take a chance on me chicken and egg problem that's how you solve it give your time add value all right I think we got that we're good all right so LinkedIn I I really like LinkedIn um you know people like could go on Tik Tok and Instagram that's like their default my default LinkedIn um when I go on LinkedIn I you know couple of things that I I had to do and I I encourage you all to do it as

well is is to refine and fill in every single piece of white space you have on your profile Okay add as much detail as you can every single word that you add in your LinkedIn profile it is searchable it is indexed within their system so when somebody is searching if a recruiter is searching for somebody that understands Cloud security and you have Cloud security that keyword listed seven times on your profile there's a higher chance that you're going to be seen right if you're tagging oh I just went through the skill builder for ISC square and I got my cloud security badge that's going to be collected it's going to be indexed in their system and so

when some somebody's searching credentials around certified professionals around Cloud security you have a higher likelihood of being found okay and the more information you have on there the more transparent you are about who you are and what you're learning the more likelihood you're going to have with them reaching out and saying hey are you open to getting on a phone call and having the conversation okay so couple of things to do when it comes to filling in that white Space is really developing your profile to its full potential have a good profile picture which I know sounds dumb but a lot of people don't do it get a clear head shot you smiling collar shirt ladies nice blouse or something

like that look good look good this is your first impression with the a potential employer that's going to hire you so you want to look good okay fill in that white space so add details in the uh in the description area of the jobs or details and and school projects that you maybe performed talk about it you know G give me everything you know just fill it in and as you're growing in your career you can alter things you can maybe cut down on certain areas because you're trying to Pivot into a New Field New sub specialty right you want to kind of refine this and this becomes an evolutionary thing you want to just kind of go with the

flow as you mature as a professional okay and so fill in that space and then of course share your knowledge blogs articles videos all of it okay one way you guys can get started today is by starting a blog I started a Blog in I think it was 206 2016 something like that and I just started sharing stuff I'm learning this oh I'm I'm I'm going through this certification oh I passed the certification here's how I passed the certification right people care people will see this they'll read it somebody else is in your shoes or or how how do I say this the shoes that you were in yesterday somebody's in today okay so the thing that you had just

accomplished I guarantee you somebody around the world is trying to accomplish this today so this is your opportunity to give back right you can do that through blogging a couple of platforms that I really like medium ghost of course you can use linkedin's built-in article system you can do that too which is great because you can gain searchability visibility by doing that but you have options and many of these are no cost you can get started at no cost if you want to get fancy with it pay a little bit more but you can afford $35 a month you're good um all right don't be afraid to talk about what you're learning you will always have something of value to

someone else I have struggled with this myself and I'm sure many of you do too right if this like uh impostor syndrome or no who's going to care what I have to say trust me somebody cares somebody cares I posted a video on YouTube it has I think close to 880,000 views here's how I passed the cissp certification in six weeks my most popular video it blows up every single time and it makes me money through ads so share it talk about it I think it's a dumb video too it's like five years old now or something like that so if you guys go see it I look skinnier and probably messy hair I record it at like

midnight but people care people care Share it talk about it share that information okay um deliver value don't hold back yes all right we talked a lot about that you want to be omnipresent on all the platforms that's always a good idea all right let's talk about getting paid who wants to talk about getting [Laughter] paid okay so I'm a big believer in building job security but not necessarily within a company I think that's kind of a fallacy that nowadays you can have job security within a company go there work there 40 years and retire that that's over with right build job security within your industry be someone that can move around be flexible on average when I jump from one

job to another I get a 30% increase every time I do it my students do the same thing how much is the average increase in wage within the same employer anyone know yeah like 3% 4% yeah kind of depends what's the uh how much did we increase in um inflation this past year like 9% your wages aren't aren't keeping up with that right so you want to be able to move be nimble and so build job security within the industry all right so uptime and availability for those that are in cyber security you may be familiar with that already for those of you who are learning it it it mainly Falls in line with the availability

piece of the CIA Triad right making sure that you are available making sure that you are um in this case right you are Nimble you are flexible you are ready and available to take on the next opportunity at a heartbeat so don't be married necessarily to a company for those employers I'm sorry um but it's true you guys are a high value commodity right you guys are a resource that many companies need so treat your career as a business okay your success in your career is all about expert positioning what have we been talking about this entire conversation here talking about expert positioning adding value building building brand awareness professional or personal brand awareness right that's how we do

that the better you position yourself the better you'll be prepared to handle corporate hardships and adversities going back to that idea of being Nimble being flexible companies are going to rise and fall that happens all the time in uh 2021 I was the VP of security engineering for a mortgage company promised a sizzo rule I got into a vis sizzo rule as soon as I got promoted two weeks after I got let go why they lost I think it was $80 million and one quarter the sizo also got Lu several I think it was several years like two years later so it happens it happens so allow yourself to have options okay remember big problems you

get big money if you can solve big problems you're going to get big money right so build your uh personal branding build your awareness build who you are as a professional in an area that's in high demands that way you can stay flexible you can always be able to jump onto new opportunity and if you feel like your skill set's getting outdated like not trying to insult anyone but I know network security is becoming more um uh congested right so I hear a lot of network security engineers like I need to learn the cloud or I need to learn devs Ops or AI security what's this thing right go ahead and start learning it start educating yourself start

adapting and talk about it okay you don't have to rebuild who you are you can just take your audience along for the journey hey this is who I am this is where I'm going this these are the things that I'm doing to go and pursue that right this is the end goal and they will love it the audience will love it all right hot skills lead to more leverage more leverage leads to better negotiations for compensation and of course you get peace of mind okay final thoughts all right control what you can and give it time okay it does take time but the best time to start something was yesterday the next best time is today right go

ahead and get going get to work okay things you can control being consistent being consistent in your education being consistent in your postings how you talk about these things online being agile right being flexible with various opportunities do what you can seek out new opportunities don't be married to a position don't be married to a company necessarily unless you're the owner tough luck um and make yourself available of course all right um going to leave you with this quote here tell me how you use your spare time and I will uh oh and how you spend your money and I will tell you where and what you will be 10 years from now this is a quote from Napoleon

Hill okay so use your time wisely don't waste it away all right guys I'm gonna leave it open for questions thank you

any questions all right yes in the

back it's a great place to start yeah yeah yeah because you get to learn the security services for AWS right they're going to teach you some of the the General Industry practices and the Frameworks and whatnot but always remember vendor specific certifications they have a goal too and that's to get you knowledgeable so you can use their services which in turn generates more revenue for them right so it's a great goal industry or uh many employers like it they will use it you know they'll take you on companies who are partners with AWS they get discounts by having more certified members so there's a value add for you there too

yeah um what you talking about for the ccsp yeah yeah I mean they do ask for that I think if you have a degree they will deduct one year so you only need four years or if you have a certain cert uh certification like Security Plus they'll take off a year um so there's ways to go about it if you don't have the five years to actually get acquire the credential I wouldn't say take it just yet I would wait go focus on those that you can get like the ccsk same damn thing as the C as ccsp yeah um it it's a little bit more heavy on frame work and GRC for the cloud there is quite a bit

of technical stuff in there as well but um what that will do is get you a credential it doesn't expire I think it's a little bit cheaper too I think it's half the cost and gets you on your way you can append it to the end of your name it looks nice that's that would be my answer to that think you had a question yes if you could pick the top three skills AC asens [Music] like high value the high value okay what would you um so right now what I know what I what I'm comfortable with Cloud security uh compliance for cloud so GRC for the cloud and then start to learn software security you don't have to be a

developer you don't have to know how to code but you can under if you can understand how the security uh controls are in place for software and understand the legality data security standards what happen you for software and Cloud they go hand in hand many development teams are on the cloud so if you know software it's great

yes how was I Nimble when I got laid off well yeah I'm always listening for opportunities man always yes yes um well what I started doing when I was there at that company was I actually started doing side Consulting so I had a little bit of a buffer of income and some savings to start playing around with to help me transition over and then I had this time period where I was like well do I want to do Consulting for myself full-time and try to scale this thing up or do I want to find another company and get some benefits and all that good stuff ultimately I did end up finding another uh job I transitioned to

ey I was a senior manager there um yeah I mean just stay open stay open to Opportunities side hustles yeah yeah that's the other thing guys like companies they don't necessarily have to bring you on and pay for all your benefits and all that stuff they'll just hire you as a contractor I think when I was doing that I was making 15K a month just doing policy procedure documents for various companies Fortune 500 companies and I was maybe working 10 hours a week on that so while I'm watching Netflix I'm writing a policy document so yeah

yes um for yeah for IC I know that Sans is really big on on Industrial control I don't know if anybody else though but Sans is a great place to get started yes

I would say so sorry they're gonna kick me out now you're at s yes [Music] okay okay are you going through their bachelor's or M Master's okay um a you know the great thing about that program is you're getting a lot of credentials and sans's training is very in-depth so you're getting a lot of good experience while you're going through those labs and all that stuff so I like that I like that now traditional universities they don't always offer that I can't speak to USF I don't know but I know a lot of universities that will just throw textbooks at you maybe they have a very quaints cutes lab where you're kind of learning some stuff you know end map or

whatever and it's not not to say that it's not beneficial I mean what it's going to do is it's going to give you leverage to negotiate a higher salary if somebody says hey we're extending you an offer for 120 and you're like I've got a master's degree you know I deserve 145 or 150 like you have a little gxs are great but gak or sanss they produce a lot of credentials that are not always going to be um known to employers there there's a few that that are known like I I know the the expert one is known the they have a couple Cloud ones that are great they have a leadership one that's really good um GC

that's like kind of like the alternative to Security Plus as far as entry level goes they have they have options yes but then they have a lot that they're trying to push and the industry is not accepting it right not not yet there could be change for that in the future so a good example of this guys is ISC squares ccsp the ccsp has been trying they've been trying to push this thing into the market and it's not really being as widely as as accepted as a cisp and they're all like oh this is the next thing next cissp it's not really not not yet right so and and a lot of that comes down to the people who have it are they

able to do the job are they able to solve the problems a lot of those multiple choice exams don't really They Don't Really test you on that you don't have to go through that training so Sans is is probably one of the better ones that gets you exposed to a lot that's nothing more than a marketing Ploy yeah yeah I mean what it does is just get you um little taste test it's like going to Costco and getting a little sample that's all you're doing with that it's free okay yeah

yes yeah

that more IND yeah um well the ccsk doesn't have an experience requirement here if I'm if I was starting out and I was trying to break in I would probably go bu the textbook for the Security Plus so I can read through it get an understand yeah yeah and then once you identify where you want to go with it with with your career start to find uh credentials or trainings that are better aligns with that specialty NE for the for the Security Plus yes yes yes there's courses online you to me 20 bucks go go through the course you don't have to get the credential but then you can beine straight out of there and go

right for whatever credential is in alignment with your uh specialty that you want to go down so good any other questions no oh yes okay you mentioned that education always fall a little behind yeah

do so you're asking how would education how like how does this change so that education can follow the industry because educ Falls a little behind yeah yeah yeah do well okay look at AI security right I guarantee you the next 5 years some credentials going to come out about it right but where when are we hearing about it the most right nowes subject matter experts are learning this stuff now and later on they're going to be hired to go and create content about this in the future so GX gonna or Sans they're gonna have something I Square may come come out with something CompTIA guarantee you they're gonna have something right so and they're they're going to they're

going to go and pay the people who are out there talking about this stuff AI security or whatever whatever the leading next thing is they're going to go and say hey we've got an offer for you I pay you $10,000 to make a course and then they're going to go monetize the hell out of that thing you know that's how that typically works and within a university look at about look at the textbooks you know that they're always falling behind it takes years to compile that information edit it go through it and then publish it and then get the universities to buy it and modify their curriculum programs to adapt this new curriculum into there and

then they go through a whole marketing cycle too so that's why it takes some time takes a couple years you got one more wish ask question is what do you

think I don't know the answer to that one because like if you look at where leading areas of Technology are are at right now we're still trying understand the long-term impacts of AI and how security is going to baked into that like how does this thing play a role in our in our working worlds so I think it I don't know if you can solve that problem like make it make the lead time shorter right um maybe if they came up with an Adaptive training model where it's like hey here's here's what we know today go ahead and start learning this and over time we start to build on to this and and modify the curriculum

around that but but I think a lot of it just comes with you know how education uh providers how they have to how you know their lead time to go find a person to teach this thing and then developing the curriculum and that that takes time that takes time so yeah you in the back

okay you when it comes to what though home

Labs I that's going to depend on the track that you're trying to go down where where you're wanting to go if you want to go in Cloud security I would expect that you have some Cloud environments that you're building and messing things up you know sandbox environments your own accounts um where you're building things you're testing new security tools and maybe releasing now we're in a safe environment and then having to remediate that so it greatly depends on where you're trying to go I think another area which I don't know if you were here while I was talking about volunteering yeah okay so that's that's a real environment right you're working with real data and hopefully working

alongside somebody that manages their it so that you can get that um relevant experience too so they both they both help okay yes

yeah so I I built my first computer when I was six and I started working with my dad I was homeschooled um so I was working with my dad on site at private schools in Miami and I was building IP phone systems building networks installing firewalls um when I was a teenager so that that's how I got started that's not necessarily the case for everybody so um you there's all different ways you can break in right you don't have to go and get your first job at $12 an hour and work your way up to health desk you you can get started by volunteering right finding areas where you can nonprofits that you can give

back at what I would do is start showing up to to nonprofit events and talk about what you do have your resume ready to go look nice and dressed well and that um you know maybe have a couple of credentials or some kind of skills that can align with a particular area you want to go down and and go down that path that's what that's what I would doing am I at time yeah okay we're good okay all right guys thank you let me we uh more conversation more questions we can have it out there all right thank you sorry I looking at your HDMI T I'm like [Music]

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